A few days ago, I published this piece on Substack (which is humor/satire, clearly, but I consider satire a legitimate form of social critique, and that’s how I’m using it in my letter to Harold).
All of this and so much more. I see this occasionally in my social media feed, and I wonder if I want to continue to have any sort of connection with these women, or if I should just continue to do my best to model better behaviors.
I also am currently being attacked on my social media page for a political post, of which I have a few, because I do know the difference between right and wrong. In this particular post, a man who I thought was a friend, made this particular comment to me, “Is there no load you won’t swallow as long as it perpetuate your inner hate.”
And to be honest, Jennie, I did not fully comprehend what he had said to me when I first read it. Then it dawned on me, and I called out the behavior. To make a long story short, I made several attempts to get an acknowledgment of what he said and to get an apology. An acknowledgement never came, much less an apology.
But here’s the thing, the entire time this was playing out, I kept thinking how grateful I am to be a part of this group and to have your wisdom and understanding to teach us to see and hear these things for what they are and to take a stand for myself / ourselves and for humanity.
So please, keep the education coming!! We are clearly hearing what you have to teach us and applying our lessons to our entire lives, not just a stupid dating app.
Wow. I am SO sorry he said that to you. 😡 Thank you also for your incredibly kind words. The worst thing about the internet is that it gives guys like this a microphone, but the even better thing about the internet is that it brings all of US together 🥰.
It can be truly shocking when people we know make really awful comments. As you said, I am also deeply grateful for Jennie's work. Thank you for sharing this because with every single thing over-sexualized, I know I am guilty of sometimes just overlooking comments. What you did is brave! Also because I personally hesitate and juggle whether or not to say something. My son is ultra-conservative (has a tradwife who often spews and shames publicly on her own FB page) and it seems we are barely treading water to keep connected. So, everything I post is "monitored." The stronger I become as a feminist, the less coupling even appeals to me.
That's the worst, scariest part of social media: you never know when someone will show their true colors. I decided to be very clear up front in my Match profile and say 'No Trump supporters please." That has pretty much ended any dating interest I've received (in Alabama 😣) . I have recently received, more than once, comments on my photos along the lines of "F*ck off! DJT is the greatest!" I have thought of softening my wording, maybe not mentioning Trump at all, but I'd much rather be attacked by strangers than find out after getting more involved, maybe sleeping with someone I really like, that they have been secretly thinking this all along. Also, I hate that I have to choose when to get attacked, now or later.
The solution to silencing women seems to involve filling their mouth with the guy's privates. In reminiscing with a college classmate who had appeared unhappy while working on a group project with me, he kept telling me 30 years later, all he wanted to do was to shove his penis in my mouth. I believe that is sexual assault.
I find what this guy said -- Is there no load you won't swallow as long as it perpetuates your inner hate -- to be very revealing about him. For one thing, he is shaming swallowing. Perhaps no woman has wanted to take what he puts out. Second, he is directly connecting men's output with feeding hate. He is unintentionally criticizing himself, and all men.
I was a couple of months into learning BHDM (and more specifically applied rhetoric) when my male boss (round about) asked me to not show my opinion on my face so much.
He was concerned that I didn’t know how expressive my face was and was perhaps unintentionally sharing ‘inside thoughts’.
I clarified that I did indeed know that my face was expressive and I was intentionally sharing thoughts in the only way that is vaguely socially acceptable for women, especially those in subordinate positions of power. I did not intend to stop.
It was very liberating. We have a much better working relationship now too.
We have every right to tackle misogyny in whatever way we feel comfortable.
He actually told you to essentially put on a mask at work so he wouldn’t have to look at your face and potentially be upset / confronted / affronted by it. I have no words. Well done for being so articulate in your response and for shutting him down. I think I would’ve been so shocked by his comments that I would be speechless. And to think women are sometimes (often) considered mean when we call men out on their bullsh#t. Well done to you. Truly inspiring.
This is happening to a number of genx women w the genz crowd and management is taking the side of the latter (you get a participation trophy). Then comes gaslighting genx during discussions, no promotions, loss of work and no support (for starters). I’m so glad you said what you did.
I think this conversation is so important now in this election cycle. If women turn on Harris (because she is a woman), we are in big trouble. But it has happened before! Stand together, ladies. It is our power!
All of this Jennie! Himpathy is a real thing and many women will expend their precious energy making excuses for men, I have received dating advice from women who do this. I just counter their bad advice with "so I am not worth kindness and respect?" and they stop, think and say that I am. Women have to unravel this or they will reduce the quality and quantity of their own lives by entertaining the Harolds of the world. I wish all women would learn to love and value themselves!
You have a beautiful gift. Thank you. When I read this paragraph:
“ Many scholars believe that internalized misogyny is not just a byproduct of the patriarchy but an active agent of it; as long as women are busy going after each other, the patriarchy continues to operate unfettered, repeating and strengthening its dynamics, and women do its work by weakening each other.”
It made me realize in what ways I have expressed internalized misogyny in my own life. It has made me realize how often we as women DO in fact go after one another and how we constantly make excuses for the poor behavior of all the Harold’s in the world (and even my own previous partners). Especially while we as women could be building one another up in sisterhood, instead of tearing each other down and creating competition. Thank you, Jennie!!! I look forward to your thought provoking posts every day. 🫶🏻🧐
I am grateful to this woman for making this comment because otherwise I would not have realised the original photo included his actual penis ! I am shocked not only that this kind of thing goes on but even more so that a woman is defending it. Ironically your post is probably the most positive thing his penis has ever done? This notion of feeling sorry for men and cutting them slack is hardly internalised misogyny but actually very overt. We are repeatedly exposed to a litany of excuses for inappropriate male behaviour which perpetuates it. Thank you Jennie xx
I’m not sure if you read the original article, but it was not apparent in that one that the picture showed his penis. I’m assuming the woman who commented on that article didn’t either, so I’m not sure she was defending him posting a pic of his penis.
I'm the original "beneficiary" of Harold's pic, and only wish I could capture as well as Jennie, exactly why it gave me the super ick. Being a part of BHDM has honed my understanding of why I have always been patriarchy-leery. It's insidious! Appreciative of all the analysis, and continuing my very (very) long search for a needle. ❤️
Good lord. I am so sorry this came up in your Bumble feed. I’m on that platform. Well, sort of. I jump on and five swipes later I snooze my profile again.
I have to ask. Where does this guy live and what did he say his interests were. Was this the first pic on his profile (you know the one they deem ‘the best’?).
I hope they agreed with your report and banned him from the platform. I’ve reported men only to have them show back up with a different name.
Reminds me of a woman who recently told me that Scott Peterson looked "sad" in one of the documentaries that explores his conviction for murdering his pregnant wife. I wish we forgave ourselves with the conviction with which we forgive mediocre men!! Love this piece, Jennie. Thanks for writing it.
I love making points with humor. I think the emotional connection humor creates helps me remember the points. Also it was a very good laugh at a very serious topic which felt great. Helps break up the frustration of the continued misogyny we all encounter everyday whether we are aware of it or not. ❤️
Yes, yes, YES! I am almost in tears I feel so seen (not the first time JY!)
A few years ago I started a Facebook group called "Drama Free: Making Fun of Men on Dating Apps"
It's all very much in the same spirit of how you took down Harold.
This is Drama Free's about section:
"Sharing screenshots of the low-effort, the meh and the red flag wavers.
We're not here to make fun of men for their looks, ages, bodies, jobs, or characteristics and qualities that other women might be into. It's not about cheap shots or punching down.
We're expressing and commiserating our weary frustration with the way men on apps present themselves that reflects and reveals their lazineness, poor choices, delusions and entitlement, and the patriarchy that enables and encourages them."
I make fun of the choices they make, choices that they have every resource and opportunity not to make.
There have been many attempts to shame me for it, but there is no shame in my game. I stand by everything I have said about every Harold and his type for all the reasons you mentioned.
I've lost a few FB friends who accused me of bullying. So be it. It's the price I'm willing to pay to have a safe space for like-minded women.
Jennie,
All of this and so much more. I see this occasionally in my social media feed, and I wonder if I want to continue to have any sort of connection with these women, or if I should just continue to do my best to model better behaviors.
I also am currently being attacked on my social media page for a political post, of which I have a few, because I do know the difference between right and wrong. In this particular post, a man who I thought was a friend, made this particular comment to me, “Is there no load you won’t swallow as long as it perpetuate your inner hate.”
And to be honest, Jennie, I did not fully comprehend what he had said to me when I first read it. Then it dawned on me, and I called out the behavior. To make a long story short, I made several attempts to get an acknowledgment of what he said and to get an apology. An acknowledgement never came, much less an apology.
But here’s the thing, the entire time this was playing out, I kept thinking how grateful I am to be a part of this group and to have your wisdom and understanding to teach us to see and hear these things for what they are and to take a stand for myself / ourselves and for humanity.
So please, keep the education coming!! We are clearly hearing what you have to teach us and applying our lessons to our entire lives, not just a stupid dating app.
I thank you from the bottom of my heart.
Paula
Wow. I am SO sorry he said that to you. 😡 Thank you also for your incredibly kind words. The worst thing about the internet is that it gives guys like this a microphone, but the even better thing about the internet is that it brings all of US together 🥰.
It can be truly shocking when people we know make really awful comments. As you said, I am also deeply grateful for Jennie's work. Thank you for sharing this because with every single thing over-sexualized, I know I am guilty of sometimes just overlooking comments. What you did is brave! Also because I personally hesitate and juggle whether or not to say something. My son is ultra-conservative (has a tradwife who often spews and shames publicly on her own FB page) and it seems we are barely treading water to keep connected. So, everything I post is "monitored." The stronger I become as a feminist, the less coupling even appeals to me.
That's the worst, scariest part of social media: you never know when someone will show their true colors. I decided to be very clear up front in my Match profile and say 'No Trump supporters please." That has pretty much ended any dating interest I've received (in Alabama 😣) . I have recently received, more than once, comments on my photos along the lines of "F*ck off! DJT is the greatest!" I have thought of softening my wording, maybe not mentioning Trump at all, but I'd much rather be attacked by strangers than find out after getting more involved, maybe sleeping with someone I really like, that they have been secretly thinking this all along. Also, I hate that I have to choose when to get attacked, now or later.
My profile used to read, "Republicans need not apply."
Some Elephant messaged me anyway.
I told him I hope he finds someone who makes him as happy as Donald and Melania and then B2B'd 😜
Hilarious. Have the day you deserve! Bless!
same, I live in a rural community, I find they don't even read what I wrote, just 'like' and expect me to do the work. glad to, B2B!
Same here, I also left it on there and agree with you...why waste one second on someone you know you'll have zero affinity with from the jump?
Block him on every medium. Burn. It. Down.
The solution to silencing women seems to involve filling their mouth with the guy's privates. In reminiscing with a college classmate who had appeared unhappy while working on a group project with me, he kept telling me 30 years later, all he wanted to do was to shove his penis in my mouth. I believe that is sexual assault.
I hope you blocked that guy! No need to waste more time and energy.
I find what this guy said -- Is there no load you won't swallow as long as it perpetuates your inner hate -- to be very revealing about him. For one thing, he is shaming swallowing. Perhaps no woman has wanted to take what he puts out. Second, he is directly connecting men's output with feeding hate. He is unintentionally criticizing himself, and all men.
I thought the piece was hysterical and spot-on. Your words here are also spot-on.
LOVE this response, Jennie! Thank you for taking the time to educate and inspire us!
I love this.
I was a couple of months into learning BHDM (and more specifically applied rhetoric) when my male boss (round about) asked me to not show my opinion on my face so much.
He was concerned that I didn’t know how expressive my face was and was perhaps unintentionally sharing ‘inside thoughts’.
I clarified that I did indeed know that my face was expressive and I was intentionally sharing thoughts in the only way that is vaguely socially acceptable for women, especially those in subordinate positions of power. I did not intend to stop.
It was very liberating. We have a much better working relationship now too.
We have every right to tackle misogyny in whatever way we feel comfortable.
He actually told you to essentially put on a mask at work so he wouldn’t have to look at your face and potentially be upset / confronted / affronted by it. I have no words. Well done for being so articulate in your response and for shutting him down. I think I would’ve been so shocked by his comments that I would be speechless. And to think women are sometimes (often) considered mean when we call men out on their bullsh#t. Well done to you. Truly inspiring.
I LOVE this. A friend was just told something similar and I'll share your response with her!
This is happening to a number of genx women w the genz crowd and management is taking the side of the latter (you get a participation trophy). Then comes gaslighting genx during discussions, no promotions, loss of work and no support (for starters). I’m so glad you said what you did.
I think this conversation is so important now in this election cycle. If women turn on Harris (because she is a woman), we are in big trouble. But it has happened before! Stand together, ladies. It is our power!
All of this Jennie! Himpathy is a real thing and many women will expend their precious energy making excuses for men, I have received dating advice from women who do this. I just counter their bad advice with "so I am not worth kindness and respect?" and they stop, think and say that I am. Women have to unravel this or they will reduce the quality and quantity of their own lives by entertaining the Harolds of the world. I wish all women would learn to love and value themselves!
Himpathy! Oo I've not heard that term before thank you.
You have a beautiful gift. Thank you. When I read this paragraph:
“ Many scholars believe that internalized misogyny is not just a byproduct of the patriarchy but an active agent of it; as long as women are busy going after each other, the patriarchy continues to operate unfettered, repeating and strengthening its dynamics, and women do its work by weakening each other.”
It made me realize in what ways I have expressed internalized misogyny in my own life. It has made me realize how often we as women DO in fact go after one another and how we constantly make excuses for the poor behavior of all the Harold’s in the world (and even my own previous partners). Especially while we as women could be building one another up in sisterhood, instead of tearing each other down and creating competition. Thank you, Jennie!!! I look forward to your thought provoking posts every day. 🫶🏻🧐
TRIANGULATION! It takes the attention off the abuser (almost) every time.
I am grateful to this woman for making this comment because otherwise I would not have realised the original photo included his actual penis ! I am shocked not only that this kind of thing goes on but even more so that a woman is defending it. Ironically your post is probably the most positive thing his penis has ever done? This notion of feeling sorry for men and cutting them slack is hardly internalised misogyny but actually very overt. We are repeatedly exposed to a litany of excuses for inappropriate male behaviour which perpetuates it. Thank you Jennie xx
I’m not sure if you read the original article, but it was not apparent in that one that the picture showed his penis. I’m assuming the woman who commented on that article didn’t either, so I’m not sure she was defending him posting a pic of his penis.
True. I did share that fact in the facebook post to which she was referring, but it's possible she read past that or something.
I'm the original "beneficiary" of Harold's pic, and only wish I could capture as well as Jennie, exactly why it gave me the super ick. Being a part of BHDM has honed my understanding of why I have always been patriarchy-leery. It's insidious! Appreciative of all the analysis, and continuing my very (very) long search for a needle. ❤️
Good lord. I am so sorry this came up in your Bumble feed. I’m on that platform. Well, sort of. I jump on and five swipes later I snooze my profile again.
I have to ask. Where does this guy live and what did he say his interests were. Was this the first pic on his profile (you know the one they deem ‘the best’?).
I hope they agreed with your report and banned him from the platform. I’ve reported men only to have them show back up with a different name.
Reminds me of a woman who recently told me that Scott Peterson looked "sad" in one of the documentaries that explores his conviction for murdering his pregnant wife. I wish we forgave ourselves with the conviction with which we forgive mediocre men!! Love this piece, Jennie. Thanks for writing it.
Amen!
I love making points with humor. I think the emotional connection humor creates helps me remember the points. Also it was a very good laugh at a very serious topic which felt great. Helps break up the frustration of the continued misogyny we all encounter everyday whether we are aware of it or not. ❤️
This is so helpful! Thank you for taking the time to so eloquently articulate this position!
Absolutely brilliant!
Perfectly stated.
Yes, yes, YES! I am almost in tears I feel so seen (not the first time JY!)
A few years ago I started a Facebook group called "Drama Free: Making Fun of Men on Dating Apps"
It's all very much in the same spirit of how you took down Harold.
This is Drama Free's about section:
"Sharing screenshots of the low-effort, the meh and the red flag wavers.
We're not here to make fun of men for their looks, ages, bodies, jobs, or characteristics and qualities that other women might be into. It's not about cheap shots or punching down.
We're expressing and commiserating our weary frustration with the way men on apps present themselves that reflects and reveals their lazineness, poor choices, delusions and entitlement, and the patriarchy that enables and encourages them."
I make fun of the choices they make, choices that they have every resource and opportunity not to make.
There have been many attempts to shame me for it, but there is no shame in my game. I stand by everything I have said about every Harold and his type for all the reasons you mentioned.
I've lost a few FB friends who accused me of bullying. So be it. It's the price I'm willing to pay to have a safe space for like-minded women.
I wrote about it a few weeks ago:
https://open.substack.com/pub/larastarr/p/its-kind-of-a-long-story-about-drama?r=fp2aa&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web
I am currently looking for your group and your link just takes you to Facebook proper, not your group.
Search for "Burned Haystack Dating Method" on Facebook and you should find it
I tried to find your group but it didn't come up in a search?
Here you go! All practitioners of BHDM are welcome :)
https://fb.me/g/8xOQnU1YL/IzhB7CMq
awesome! Thanks so much!
Excellent response, Jennie! Thank you as always.