In addition to every other red flag in this concerning profile, I couldn’t avoid noticing that he just had to talk about his food intake—“enjoy cooking well, healthy eating habits with the odd treat after coffee”—in the very limited amount of space provided in a dating profile.
I like to call this the “No Fat Chicks” pattern.
What Mr. NFC is sharing about himself is that he will expect you to restrict yourself the same way that he does. Men like this love to police women’s weight, bodies, and food choices under the guise of being health conscious. It’s all about control.
SO many ways they say "NFC" without saying "NFC." I'm ABSOLUTELY FINE with not everyone being attracted to me at my current weight/body (even at my thinnest I've always been into DadBod) I will allow any preference anyone has. But the wannabe stealth way they skirt around it is maddening.
Given the profile, I suspect that this is a man who, if pressed, would claim that this is just a song he thought was cool and not something he really felt was an anthem. He would claim that you are overthinking it, or taking things too seriously.
That's still a red flag, because the indicates that he doesn't put enough thought into things that should be thought of carefully, like choosing a song to claim is your personal anthem.
It shows a lack of appropriate attention to detail, and empathy for women who have to carefully dissect a profile, as one should when trying to choose a life partner and what is potentially a life or death situation for us.
There is no way to spin this song choice that makes him not a red flag.
Omg, the number of men who don't bother to proofread their bios, and leave them almost illegible! Are they not wanting to impress women at all? Are they trying to indicate the abysmal amount of effort they'd put into a relationship?
1) They are s0 used to being rewarded for mediocre behavior and work, they don't know what effort is
2) Effort = vulnerability. If they make an effort, that means they care about the outcome/want something to come of it. To admit/acknowledge that is so scary, they don't.
3) Boys. Are. Stupid (it's astounding but not surprising how often #3 is the answer to so many of the world's questions)
Without wanting to sound snobbish I came to the conclusion that yes, all of the above, or they are high when they write the profile. Or, most likely, they’re just illiterate (and don’t have the nous to ask friends or use AI to sanity check) 🤷♀️
I see these poorly written profiles from both genders. I think it's a trend. I am on "Are we Dating the Same Guy" FB group (with groups in most major North American cities) and people screenshot their own and the guy they are asking/warning about's profiles. They are usually sparse, poorly written, not really a Bio, more a request list. It might be a younger person trend? If this poster was older, then he's likely reading younger women Bios and copying that format. It's a whole education system that awards mediocrity and bare minimum effort in an attempt to get any sort of grade level response in order to pass a student. It's getting worse, but fair warning, the twenty year olds are just the tip of the iceburg. In a few decades AI is going to be the only thing writing in complete sentences.
Unfortunately it will wreck the Burn the Haystack method because there won't be enough info to find the red flags or toxic traits.
The number of times a man has said something to the effect of, “I don’t listen to lyrics”. Maybe that’s its own rhetorical pattern. He won’t be listening to the words I say to him either 🤔
I enjoy reading your critical discourse analysis for a couple of reasons.
Firstly, your words often articulate clearly what I think and feel, yet struggle to express.
Secondly and more importantly, this learning is equipping me with the wisdom and courage to break inter generational tolerance to misogyny, acceptance of subordination, and lifelong religious patriarchal indoctrination.
Your work is the explanation, insights, antidote and permission my life has needed, to stop making excuses for and accepting toxic masculinity.
Oh how I wish Burned Haystack were around 40 years ago. I have no regrets about having my wonderful daughter but honestly thinking back on dating and my two unhappy marriages, if I had had these tools I probably never would’ve had relationships with men at all. Just thinking about it makes me tired.
BHDM has helped me feel less crazy for being so suspicious of men. I spent a lifetime trying to excuse, minimize and ignore terrible male behavior - because that’s what the world teaches women.
However, I am grateful to live in this era of growing awareness, for us all. From movements like 4B, and women talking to each other and actively working to decenter men, it’s refreshing to finally hear the truth spoken out loud. ❤️
2) That profile had so many red and pink flags, but I'm not gonna get into that
3) YES to all this! I once had a therapist (a woman therapist!) accuse me of "over analyzing" because I let her know that several of her choices (shaking her hair out of a messy bun while I was talking, rocking in a rocking chair in our Zoom session, leading off the session with "How are you?" when I asked her not to) were not assuring me she was a safe and competent place for my vulnerability.
I replied, "HELL YES I'm 'over analyzing.' Not only is this therapy, and that's what we're here to do, but this is like dating. I'm looking for and at every cue and clue I can for information that this is a good match."
Before I got to the song part, the part that was a little concerning for me was that he sounded like he was describing exactly how things would go in the relationship, if there was to be a relationship. We do this on weekends, we have the music on, etc. That would concern me. Then the song exemplifies that 100 times. It will all be about him and what he wants, he will cross boundaries, not be able to negotiate, etc. Abusive men can make their profiles sound quite good. I posted my abusive ex's once on Burned Haystack and most people thought he sounded nice, or great, even. Including Jennie. A few people caught the subtle cues of love bombing and bragging about all the personal work he'd done.
Ooohhh, great way to tie the song in with the profile! I had thought of the song as being the opposite of the profile, but this makes sense. He describes himself as easygoing, but the song says "if you lose your cool, I'll lose mine".
So basically if you ask for compromise or change of any kind, he'll refuse. And if you protest, he'll take that as you "losing your cool" and retaliate. Then blame you, because he's SO easygoing, so obviously if he became abusive, it's because you MADE him become abusive. What a nightmare!
A lot of people miss that last red flag. Boasting about doing a bunch of "personal work." I call these people "oh-so-evolved" and they are insufferable. Often realllly good at putting a veneer of personal-growth workshop language on their gaslighting and bvll5h1t.
Jennie, you didn't mention this section specifically, but I've gotta say this is possibly the most terrifying part: "You can take these pills red, white and blue
Yes! Creepy! I also thought the “red pill” line was a tell that this guy is deep in the seduction/pickup artist/manosphere misogyny online fora. Big yikes!
As little girls, we are fed fairy tales that Prince Charming (a complete stranger) will come and save us. But little girls should be fed tales that teach them that we can save ourselves, and to be careful, because many men will present themselves as something they are not. A wolf in sheep’s clothing.
This is a perfect illustration of a wolf in sheep’s clothing. An abuser often presents himself as an ordinary easy-going likeable guy on the surface. But if you look closely or give him enough time, he shows himself to be a monster. This is the most valuable lesson that one of us can teach our little daughters.
Old teaching: “give him the benefit of the doubt”
New teaching: “trust is earned not freely given”
If all of us were raised with this kind of teaching, so many of us would not have gone through the heartache that we did
Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde kinda guy. He plays the evolved "good guy" on the surface...except his dark side is very scary. The red line song is a loud booming red flag song! I am at the end of a 20+ year relationship to a milder (but still emotionally damaging) version of this man's profile.
Thank you Jennie, I am learning so much and so fast. A month ago after joining your Burned Haystack Dating FB group and started reading the posts, I quickly sent my therapist links to all of your work. And I was lamenting to her how I wanted to read the book you would write. Not knowing you were already in the works on this. It felt like magic to then read your new book announcements last week.
I don't think so, on the primary basis of his anthem being someone else's art. If he wrote it, yeah, I would report him. For instance, I'm not into biker culture of skulls and crossbones. I swipe left. Unless they photograph real human remains. Then I report them.
Odd in this context means occasional, as in every now and then he has a treat with/after having his coffee. ETA, that’s what it should mean, idk if his idea of a treat means his prospective date 😂
I was wondering the same thing! I don't think it is a language issue on your part, I have no idea what that means either. Really strange. It could be sexual? or drug related?
There are so many other issues with the song and profile, I guess the "odd treat" one didn't make the top 10 list, lol!!
Nah, that profile is chock full of red flags, but I honestly don't think that phrase is one of them. I use that turn of phrase all the time myself, the word odd just refers to occaaional/random. "There's little foot traffic on my street, except for the odd dog walker or two."
His endorsing a song glorifying being a warmonger and "dropping drones inside Iran" also indicates the "At the capitol on Jan. 6th (sic)" rhetorical pattern, as well as support for War On Terror/Islamaphobia-type propaganda.
In addition to every other red flag in this concerning profile, I couldn’t avoid noticing that he just had to talk about his food intake—“enjoy cooking well, healthy eating habits with the odd treat after coffee”—in the very limited amount of space provided in a dating profile.
I like to call this the “No Fat Chicks” pattern.
What Mr. NFC is sharing about himself is that he will expect you to restrict yourself the same way that he does. Men like this love to police women’s weight, bodies, and food choices under the guise of being health conscious. It’s all about control.
SO many ways they say "NFC" without saying "NFC." I'm ABSOLUTELY FINE with not everyone being attracted to me at my current weight/body (even at my thinnest I've always been into DadBod) I will allow any preference anyone has. But the wannabe stealth way they skirt around it is maddening.
Yes! I am active fat who eats pretty healthy in most cases so it annoys me when they use healthy eating and “active” as NFC lines.
Lord, all the rest blinded me to why that part bugged me. Spot-on, Michelle.
Good catch! So true!!!
I suppose you can say you are health conscious, into fitness and like to cook without being a jerk about it.
Given the profile, I suspect that this is a man who, if pressed, would claim that this is just a song he thought was cool and not something he really felt was an anthem. He would claim that you are overthinking it, or taking things too seriously.
That's still a red flag, because the indicates that he doesn't put enough thought into things that should be thought of carefully, like choosing a song to claim is your personal anthem.
It shows a lack of appropriate attention to detail, and empathy for women who have to carefully dissect a profile, as one should when trying to choose a life partner and what is potentially a life or death situation for us.
There is no way to spin this song choice that makes him not a red flag.
'Zactly! My current overused phrase is, "He doesn't understand the assignment." That enough is a B2B.
To earn a mere passing grade, the assignment is:
- 4-5 good photos
- 4-5 good, complete sentences
- Intention with which prompts to answer
- Indication you have looked back at your profile once you have posted it to ensure you're putting your best foot forward
Omg, the number of men who don't bother to proofread their bios, and leave them almost illegible! Are they not wanting to impress women at all? Are they trying to indicate the abysmal amount of effort they'd put into a relationship?
My theories are:
1) They are s0 used to being rewarded for mediocre behavior and work, they don't know what effort is
2) Effort = vulnerability. If they make an effort, that means they care about the outcome/want something to come of it. To admit/acknowledge that is so scary, they don't.
3) Boys. Are. Stupid (it's astounding but not surprising how often #3 is the answer to so many of the world's questions)
Without wanting to sound snobbish I came to the conclusion that yes, all of the above, or they are high when they write the profile. Or, most likely, they’re just illiterate (and don’t have the nous to ask friends or use AI to sanity check) 🤷♀️
I see these poorly written profiles from both genders. I think it's a trend. I am on "Are we Dating the Same Guy" FB group (with groups in most major North American cities) and people screenshot their own and the guy they are asking/warning about's profiles. They are usually sparse, poorly written, not really a Bio, more a request list. It might be a younger person trend? If this poster was older, then he's likely reading younger women Bios and copying that format. It's a whole education system that awards mediocrity and bare minimum effort in an attempt to get any sort of grade level response in order to pass a student. It's getting worse, but fair warning, the twenty year olds are just the tip of the iceburg. In a few decades AI is going to be the only thing writing in complete sentences.
Unfortunately it will wreck the Burn the Haystack method because there won't be enough info to find the red flags or toxic traits.
I've seen my 21-year-old son's bio. This is not a "younger person trend."
Unless your son is just not typivof his age group...
The number of times a man has said something to the effect of, “I don’t listen to lyrics”. Maybe that’s its own rhetorical pattern. He won’t be listening to the words I say to him either 🤔
I enjoy reading your critical discourse analysis for a couple of reasons.
Firstly, your words often articulate clearly what I think and feel, yet struggle to express.
Secondly and more importantly, this learning is equipping me with the wisdom and courage to break inter generational tolerance to misogyny, acceptance of subordination, and lifelong religious patriarchal indoctrination.
Your work is the explanation, insights, antidote and permission my life has needed, to stop making excuses for and accepting toxic masculinity.
Thank you.
Well said and shared. I felt this.
Okay, so this is making me want to ask every man what his personal anthem song would be - because really, how telling was this?
My Bumble opening line is: "I'd love to know about a book, movie and/or song that really stuck with you and why." The answer is always revealing.
That’s so good! Thank you for sharing that with us.
I may have to steal that one. Thank you!
Oh how I wish Burned Haystack were around 40 years ago. I have no regrets about having my wonderful daughter but honestly thinking back on dating and my two unhappy marriages, if I had had these tools I probably never would’ve had relationships with men at all. Just thinking about it makes me tired.
100%! Same here 😣
BHDM has helped me feel less crazy for being so suspicious of men. I spent a lifetime trying to excuse, minimize and ignore terrible male behavior - because that’s what the world teaches women.
However, I am grateful to live in this era of growing awareness, for us all. From movements like 4B, and women talking to each other and actively working to decenter men, it’s refreshing to finally hear the truth spoken out loud. ❤️
1) THANK you, as always, for all you do
2) That profile had so many red and pink flags, but I'm not gonna get into that
3) YES to all this! I once had a therapist (a woman therapist!) accuse me of "over analyzing" because I let her know that several of her choices (shaking her hair out of a messy bun while I was talking, rocking in a rocking chair in our Zoom session, leading off the session with "How are you?" when I asked her not to) were not assuring me she was a safe and competent place for my vulnerability.
I replied, "HELL YES I'm 'over analyzing.' Not only is this therapy, and that's what we're here to do, but this is like dating. I'm looking for and at every cue and clue I can for information that this is a good match."
Feh! I B2B'd her.
Such an important point. Therapy is an intimate relationship and the fact that she dismissed your concerns showed that you weren’t safe with her.
Been waiting for this one! Spot on Jennie, and the "I'm not fixing me, I'm fixing you" is such an announcement.
Also: damn you wrote that book FAST!! Wow. 👏🏼Looking forward. How long was it? It seemed like 3 month turnaround!
Before I got to the song part, the part that was a little concerning for me was that he sounded like he was describing exactly how things would go in the relationship, if there was to be a relationship. We do this on weekends, we have the music on, etc. That would concern me. Then the song exemplifies that 100 times. It will all be about him and what he wants, he will cross boundaries, not be able to negotiate, etc. Abusive men can make their profiles sound quite good. I posted my abusive ex's once on Burned Haystack and most people thought he sounded nice, or great, even. Including Jennie. A few people caught the subtle cues of love bombing and bragging about all the personal work he'd done.
Ooohhh, great way to tie the song in with the profile! I had thought of the song as being the opposite of the profile, but this makes sense. He describes himself as easygoing, but the song says "if you lose your cool, I'll lose mine".
So basically if you ask for compromise or change of any kind, he'll refuse. And if you protest, he'll take that as you "losing your cool" and retaliate. Then blame you, because he's SO easygoing, so obviously if he became abusive, it's because you MADE him become abusive. What a nightmare!
A lot of people miss that last red flag. Boasting about doing a bunch of "personal work." I call these people "oh-so-evolved" and they are insufferable. Often realllly good at putting a veneer of personal-growth workshop language on their gaslighting and bvll5h1t.
No matter what the profile said, I would B2B after reading the lyrics to that song. It just feels like a threat.
Jennie, you didn't mention this section specifically, but I've gotta say this is possibly the most terrifying part: "You can take these pills red, white and blue
They go down, down, down with a pack of beer
Then your eyes go dark and you cannot hear
I might tie you up, see what you got
I got a feeling that you're gonna get hot"
Can you say "date rape?"
Or even kill. Trailer, cabin - can kill you and dispose of your body...
I didn't catch that but you are so right!!
Yes! Creepy! I also thought the “red pill” line was a tell that this guy is deep in the seduction/pickup artist/manosphere misogyny online fora. Big yikes!
As little girls, we are fed fairy tales that Prince Charming (a complete stranger) will come and save us. But little girls should be fed tales that teach them that we can save ourselves, and to be careful, because many men will present themselves as something they are not. A wolf in sheep’s clothing.
This is a perfect illustration of a wolf in sheep’s clothing. An abuser often presents himself as an ordinary easy-going likeable guy on the surface. But if you look closely or give him enough time, he shows himself to be a monster. This is the most valuable lesson that one of us can teach our little daughters.
Old teaching: “give him the benefit of the doubt”
New teaching: “trust is earned not freely given”
If all of us were raised with this kind of teaching, so many of us would not have gone through the heartache that we did
Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde kinda guy. He plays the evolved "good guy" on the surface...except his dark side is very scary. The red line song is a loud booming red flag song! I am at the end of a 20+ year relationship to a milder (but still emotionally damaging) version of this man's profile.
Thank you Jennie, I am learning so much and so fast. A month ago after joining your Burned Haystack Dating FB group and started reading the posts, I quickly sent my therapist links to all of your work. And I was lamenting to her how I wanted to read the book you would write. Not knowing you were already in the works on this. It felt like magic to then read your new book announcements last week.
Should this guy be reported to the app? He seems very dangerous. As a trauma survivor
I found the song to be very frightening.
I don't think so, on the primary basis of his anthem being someone else's art. If he wrote it, yeah, I would report him. For instance, I'm not into biker culture of skulls and crossbones. I swipe left. Unless they photograph real human remains. Then I report them.
You have seen photos of human remains on dating apps?!? That is insane.
No, I haven't seen human remains that i know of on a dating app.
It might be a language thing (I'm from Europe and English isn't my first language), but what is an 'odd treat after coffee'? 🤔 Is this a thing?
(Not familiar with this, my first association was: Might this be something sexual?
As in 'Netflix and chill' or as in 'asking someone to come up for coffee' after a date, which almost never means literal coffee?)
Odd in this context means occasional, as in every now and then he has a treat with/after having his coffee. ETA, that’s what it should mean, idk if his idea of a treat means his prospective date 😂
I was wondering the same thing! I don't think it is a language issue on your part, I have no idea what that means either. Really strange. It could be sexual? or drug related?
There are so many other issues with the song and profile, I guess the "odd treat" one didn't make the top 10 list, lol!!
Nah, that profile is chock full of red flags, but I honestly don't think that phrase is one of them. I use that turn of phrase all the time myself, the word odd just refers to occaaional/random. "There's little foot traffic on my street, except for the odd dog walker or two."
Jennie... You are doing the Lord's work here. That's it, that's the tweet. THANK YOU!!!
His endorsing a song glorifying being a warmonger and "dropping drones inside Iran" also indicates the "At the capitol on Jan. 6th (sic)" rhetorical pattern, as well as support for War On Terror/Islamaphobia-type propaganda.